Long story short, if the dealer is saying that you are not eligible because of a lapse in registration, it means that you need to either return the vehicle or reimburse the dealer for the voucher amount. If you are not elibible for the program, then the dealer has every legal right to pursue you for the return of the vehicle or for reimbursement. All that "other" stuff is irrelevant.

I recently traded in a "clunker" for a new car. The CT Dealership told me what I needed (title, past two registrations, insurance card and letter from Agent stating coverage last year). I supplied these. We completed paperwork including a contract , loan, and temp. registration. (they said could not print final reg. as system was down). I asked if everyting was in order. They say "yes, and if we find any issues that will be our problem. Once you drive off we are done". I signed over my title too. I then drove home with the car. They call the next day and say that there was laps in my registration that they just noticed. I do not recall any but they say DMV insists and they want the car back. There was no conditional clause in the contract and just states $4500 trade in. Can they do this? They are saying that they can do this and will refuse to now register the car (lucky for them their system was down). I do have the temp but only good for 2 weeks. Doesn't issuing the temp imply they are bound to put through a "real" registration? Would that be a breach of contract? Also, if my registration did, in fact, have a laps (not sure how but anything is possible) does that play into things even if there was no condition stated or signed on the contract, nor “Summary of Sale and cerification” form signed? Lastly, if I do have to give the car back am I liable for mileage driven (when I left the dealership I went on a weekend vacation driving 400 miles each way!! I wanted to get used to the car as well as break it in)

This is a great example of why the government should stay out of the car business or any private business. Dealers are basically fronting the government thousands of dollars, the government isn't paying out in a timely manner, and of course the dealers get to take crap from everybody, no wonder dealers started walking away from this well thought out program.

And let's not forget the best part, the low income people in our nation get screwed again. I hear daily from customers how they can't believe how many really nice cars are being destroyed in this program, you guys taking these vehicles in know what I am talking about. This program has also driven prices up at the auctions, because instead of taking in a trade in that can be retailed they are sending them to the wreckers, so now dealers are fighting to stock up their lots, which in turn raises prices, screwing our lower income citizens again.

I signed a deal for a car back on July 31. My old vehicle has been owned and insured by myself since 1997 with absolutely no lapses in insurance or registration.
My dealer WILL NOT release any cars under the program until they get paid. I called the cars hotline and was told that they were only collecting information and weren't really doing anything against the dealers at all.
She kept saying that the dealer would be paid in 10 days. She didn't say whether the 10 days started when I signed the deal or after the rebate was approved. I tried to get it clear, but she just kept stating the program was designed for payment within 10 days.
So, here I am 22 days later, still waiting for my vehicle. I also still have my clunker. I'm worried that somehow my deal will eventually become invalid and I will have to start all over with a 13 year old car with over 218,000 miles that won't get my any kind of trade in value like this program.

@Jeff,
Just a follow-up on the situation with that dealership. They attempted to claim that they were submitting for approvals first and then later would be submitting for the rebate monies. I told them that that is not how I understand how it works from all the research I had done on the CARS.gov website from both the consumer and dealer sides. From what I understand is that it is one form/one filing. You apply for the program and it is both for approval and the rebate. I then said that the rebate money is between them and the gov't as they tried to claim that the girlfriend would have to sign an agreement to pay back the money if rejected by CARS.gov. I told them that they cannot force her to do that. If she wanted to agree to that, then that is her perogative, but it is not a part of the program. You make the sale, deliver the vehicle, submit to the program, that's it! I then was told that I would have to speak with the mgr, but not too long after the sales person came back and stated that the mgr was 10 deep and stated the they would P/D the car for delivery Monday evening - so they knew I had done my homework and gave in. Hopefully, she will take delivery Monday night (I will be there, too) without any added tricks. I did not get to the point of stating the I would be reporting them to the various factions I noted earlier. It is unfortunate how many other consumers this dealership has pulled this off on. There were many vehicles there with the "Sold" sticker on them, but not as many "clunkers" there (could have scrapped many already). But, it could be that others have challenged them and the been delivered the vehicle, but many don't even know what is happening to them. I am still debating on reporting them even after she receives delivery on Monday. I was not rude or insulting in any manner, just had done my homework and therefore had plenty information as my weapon against their lies.
Thanks again,
Joel

@Jeff,
Thank you for your follow-up and support. That text from the Dealer part of the CARS.gov site is exactly what I am going to present to them first. Wish us luck!
-Joel

Hi, I am a customer and have just returned from out of town. Last weekend my girlfriend and went out shopping for the CARS program. I had done a lot of homework prior to going to the dealers and knew her car qualified along with her paperwork and various other facets of the program. While away, she panicked due to the new deadline and went out and cut the deal on her own. The dealer has violated the rules of the program and made her take her clunker home attempting to wait for approval and/or payment. The website clearly states that they are to release the new car before sending form to CARS. She signed the title of the clunker over to them, got financing, gave a 13k downpayment, and has no car to show for it. We are going to go there today and I will confront them on this and if the new car is not given, then I will threaten reporting them to NHTSA, CARS.gov, and my state's attorney general's office. She has a P/A signed by them. Is there any other advice that I could receive before going down there.
Thank you ahead of time!

Sheri,
if the lapse was within the last twelve months the govt is supposed to reject the application for the money. it would be smart to let the dealer know immediately, and find out if they were accidently paid for it. doubtful, but you could get lucky. otherwise, the dealer will be just as eager to resolve this issue, so i would call them right away.

I recently partipcated in the program, having all my documentation in order. Two years worth of insurance, two years registration, yada yada. While putting my papers away, I realize that my insurance had actually lapsed by two days. I had switched companies. I cannot believe I did not remember and did not catch this...but worse..why didn't the dealer catch it? What do I need to do now? How much trouble will I be in and I hope to god my clunker hasn't been destroyed!

OK, thanks! Sucks but good to know its just not me!

Not for 90 minutes.

Can anyone log on to the cars.gov site?

I have been waiting for the paperwork to get approved since Aug.12, but the dealership did tell me that it would be at least two weeks. I was hoping that it would be sooner.

You can negotiate a traditional trade-in at your dealership. But given the information above, you are not eligible to participate in the CARS program at this time -- and attemts to participate can net you some serious legal trouble.

so i havent had my car for up to a year, let alone on insurance; is there NO WAY i can get rid of it??

Hi Clunker Queen I haven't checked yet this morning, but 14 so far. We really got "caught-up" last week -- after we put July to bed. Submission is taking less time now -- we scan all documents in order into one PDF titled All_Documents_Attached per the NHTSA-NADA webinar on 8-3-09, and the site is working fine. With necessary docs going "upstairs" labled like I mentioned, we basically have a "scanner" and a "submitter" and are able to keep-up with new deals as they arrive. If your paperwork is in order, from scan to "submit," plan on 30 minutes or so for each one.

Question for the Car Czar - the Clunker Queen at mid-size Nissan Suzuki store. I have a question for you... Many employees and man hours would you estimate are tied up in submiting 200 invoices. We have 65 deals "on the street" and if we get even close to caught up Friday/Satuday sales just put us back in the weeds on submission. Not to mention as you said not collecting all paperwork up front.

Just curious... How payments have you guys seen?

I don't think I'm too worried about accuracy of the submissions. It's the horror stories of errors without codes, inconsistent approvals, and the like. Human error will take place in some circumstances, but it's impossible to know that you've made a mistake when you are under review for weeks without any indication that you've done something right or wrong. I know of 4 dealers within 5 miles of my place that have pulled out of the prgram due to lack of supporting funds. I can't remember a more ironic situation in 20 years of doing this. Stimulating the auto industry by making dealers front billions of dollars. Very frustrating.

I function as the CARS Czar for a large dealership -- we've submitted over 200 invoices and have been successful with 14 so far -- none currently in rejection status. Dealers who are worried about submissions being rejected need to adopt the following philosophy: Make it Simple! Do not give the Auditors an opportunity to reject the deal. In my role as the Czar here, I eyeball all the paperwork before we sign-off on it -- while the customer is still here. And it's very simple: if it's not perfect, the deal doesn't get done! Now at first, we had some miffed Sales Managers, but after sending them back a dozen times to re-write sloppy deals, get better copies of insurance, etc., they got the picture. I will then literally spell-it-out for the auditors on the copies before I scan them: "Insurance Page 1 of 3: Qualifying Date," "Current Reg, Title Date of Issue 5-14-95, Please see title above." Spell it out for them and make it easy: pretend you are sumbitting documents to 10-year-olds who need all the help they can get! This is truly an area foreign to us car people: we really need to slow-down to speed-up. Last tip: if you haven't actually read the checklist, take 25 minutes and ingest it thoroughly. It really is an A-B-C approach to submitting vouchers and gaining approvals -- another instance where simply slowing-down and taking 25 minutes will save you days or even weeks in the future.

according to the deeler support group at nhtsa, it is. we have 0 rejections, and 0 approvals dating back to the 28th. The big fear is having 3 week old submissions rejected, only to start the waiting game again...

I have had deals pending review since July 30th that have still not been looked at. Is this normal?

alex-
were you actually paid, or approved for a deal?

nicole-
To cancel something that is in review, please e‑mail this unwieldy address 9-amc-nhtsa-cars-ap-supplier@faa.gov from the e‑mail account that was used to register with the site. In the subject field type in “cancel” and follow that with the invoice number.

Jon - we were finally paid for a deal. Which means we are almost at 3% being funded.

So Alex, how many cars have you taken in on the program and how many have you been paid on? I know you guys started earlier than most on this program, so I am sure you have a staggering number of cars lining your back lot.