Okay Alex;

"B.O.B." or Big Orange Button is something you like. And, it may have some added value. But, its still another widget to traditional advertising approaches that just are not very efficient.

AT could make a gigantic splash with B.O.B. if they used it as a social media marketing campaign. If they borrow from my ABC Exclusive Auto Buying Clubs model and give general consumers the option of placing the B.O.B. across their social media networks as a means of earning a few bucks, then they get DYNAMIC!

Afterall, 'SHOPPERS ARE NOT LINEAR' (right, Joe) and all the doors to AT that can be opened represent an opportunity for 'the handshake' to occur. And, by leveraging social media, 'the handshake' delivered can actually be a warm one - the most valuable one.

I have more on this, Alex...love to share it with you, champion!

Great point here Drew;

A threat of Socialization is we are so early into it that some (mostly, older) pro's will interpret its value based upon a particular set of perspectives that would force it into the capsule of success they have experienced in the past. We both know, auto retail isn't exactly touted for futurisitc and innovative approach - been doing it the same way 120 years!

Connecting dealers' consultants with consumers or customers is the exact bottom line, Drew.

However, at Cox, it would be 2021 before they got through the bureaucratic rigamarow necessary to move an initiative forward to do this, so they just keep beating the dead horse. And Cars is number two, they are only there to follow number one. Its how big business works, and why you see the size of traditional employers shrinking and emergence of entrepreneurship spiking as we get into the action months of 2011.

I got a plan, it gets more customers to you/your dealers' consultants, and we can talk about it if you'd like.

J. Kershner;

D. Rawls here superstar champion...

Alright, the 'SHOPPERS ARE NOT LINEAR' comment is the most valuable one in this entire Thread, thus far.

As commented much earlier in this Thread, I believe any new product from AT and Cars will fall short if it does not leverage 'the handshake'.

'THE HANDSHAKE' = (CONSULTANT+CONSUMER) x TRANSACTION

'THE HANDSHAKE'
A can't miss formula for these companies to tout the measure of success they can offer dealer clientele is to produce a means of capturing 'the handshake' earliest, and managing the entire relationship through the consultant/consumer transaction, and hopefully into antiquity.

CONSULTANT
As the eventual manager of the greatest majority of all car deals is the CONSULTANT. Now, in discussions I've had since Joe blasted me for being such a peon, I discovered there are industry personalities who call them "Sales People" or something still more indicative of the traditional hierarchy of auto retail industries that is now obsolete.

An Information Age has most shoppers (well over 80%) absolutely accessing more info than ever before since it is available easily online. 'Easily' is key. A Top Performing Sales Professional (who we call "Consultants") can 'easily' handle all the holes Joe, Mike, LightenUp, and all these potential innovators of AT and Cars products that will somehow become something that traditional advertising has never been-Efficient!

At any traditional online buying service, only one 50% portion of 'the handshake' is trackable. Hence the inability to determine what 'A Million Unique Visitors' means to a dealer client's ROI.

AT and Cars are going to find the next evolution of any online buying service offering with a better value proposition will need to have the ability to track exactly what is happening with the consumer online, and exactly what percentage of them Transacted business with a particular dealer client as a result of any AT or Cars product.

And, in order to deliver such efficiency, AT and Cars will find themselves tapping into the other 50% portion of 'the handshake'. Consultants have always, and always will (in the foreseeable future) manage 'the handshake' of any auto retail transaction. OBS Future will absolutely leverage this!

CONSUMER
A shopper is an independent potential customer of a particular brand or product. 'SHOPPERS ARE NOT LINEAR' is the truest post to this entire Thread, and it takes us along this road. An impulse is necessary to move a shopper from wherever they might be into our 'Transaction'.

Auto retail present is almost out of impulse. The car isn't an impulse most times because 80% of consumers already have studied it well online. Pricing is not even an impulse. AT and Cars must produce a platform for establishing an involuntary inclination prompting to action...

AutoTrader's Chip Perry had the advantage of knowing this 5 or 6 years ago, because I told it to him.

More to come...

Joe wrote: "Roll with me Lightenup, you're on a roll, but, LOOK deeper and ask for all the evidence that would agree with your conclusion(s).
FAIL."

The evidence is in the dealership's showroom on a daily basis. The FAIL is in the evidence technicians (salespeople) failure to collect and categorize the evidence.

Joe wrote: "I ask you... WHERE ARE THE EAGER BUYERS asking dealers everywhere... "do you still have the car?""

That's my point Joe. They aren't calling, they aren't emailing... they are coming in to look at the car. However, because most dealership pay plans encourage the floor salespeople NOT to find out if the customer saw the car on the Internet (for fear of having to split or give up the entire deal), they go uncounted as a conversion. The behavioral end-game that you are seeking - physical visit - is actually happening, it's just not being documented.

Finally Mr. Pistell;

This thread activates the truest matter at hand - how to track what an online lead from any AT or Cars feature/page translates into for the dealers in terms of Transactions.

You are right! (And, to think I was about to write an article per your request called "Takin' Joe's Pistell).

SHOPPERS ARE NOT LINEAR!

Every lead on AT or on Cars will have its own merit. Some are dead set on buying the exact car they clicked through. Some are not set on buying any particular car at the time of their visit to the website. Some have been to Edmunds, TrueCar, and every site affiliated with the car they have an interest in buying. They probably won’t pay much profit to who ever sells them their car, especially if it’s a new car. But, some customers research online and still will pay profit.

The point here is, SHOPPERS ARE NOT LINEAR! (Good job Joe!)

Now, I can expound more on this, but it will probably result in Joe telling me to submit my own article about any service I offer that makes "our industry" better, since I have no relevance to such a high-ranking discussion about this matter of creating ROI. Shame, we discuss socialization, and practice the antithesis of it at the same time.

More to come...

Lightenup, you ask:

"I'm curious as to what information you feel a shopper can find on the dealer's website that they would not find in the online listings of a dealer doing a good job merchandising their inventory on ATC or cars.com."

IMO, this is the "HOLE" that causes the dis-connect. Many months ago, I was fishing for data for exactly this. See it at: http://forum.dealerrefresh.com/f40/whats-car-shoppers-mind-1025.html

IMO, the only way to do this is a well built study that collects feedback of "in market" shoppers.

LASTLY: SHOPPERS ARE NOT LINEAR. See The Internet Shopper Experience Chart – DealerRefresh

Lightenup, you wrote:

"Joe, You stated a couple of times that there are still too many unanswered questions after an online automotive shopper has done their research and price discovery... There is so much specific vehicle information, multiple photos, dealership information, payment calculators, links to advice on buying, financing, leasing, insuring, online credit application, etc., what else is left for the shopper to ask other than, "do you still have the car?" ...."

Roll with me Lightenup, you're on a roll, but, LOOK deeper and ask for all the evidence that would agree with your conclusion(s). I ask you... WHERE ARE THE EAGER BUYERS asking dealers everywhere... "do you still have the car?"

FAIL.

Wipe all your pre-conceptions clean and try to find the "HOLE" in shopping trail. We have to remember that this is CATALOG shopping, not ecommerce shopping. Just like your projection TV example, Catalog shopping end-game is a visit to the physical store. Tracking conversions and optimizing for conversions -without embracing the catalog shoppers needs- is a setup for a fail.

Drew, more Eureka! link evidence. Compare the Eureka! link conversion ratio to the site overall. 16% is a very strong number in my book.

Problem: We cannot tell what the closing ratio is for these visitors, ergo the Eureka! Link Gateway lead tool.

Ya...Craigslist and Cars apply as well. Craigslist conversion is slighly higher. But on Craigslist this same dealer gets alot of people that click on the "get financing" link.

Lightenup,

On Vaca, I have MANY rebuttals to your reply, but, the wife is giving me the "Evil look" the ocean is calling! look for my reply asap!

Michael,

You drive a million visits to dealers web sites yet, you and your dealers HAVE NO IDEA what that means to anyone (including you). There is a big ass disconnect between classified sites and dealer sales and this disconnect is the root of dealer angst.

This post is a mental exercise in how to find leverage points on your platform, create tools to improve the shopper & dealer experience in one move.

Alex, IMO adding a BOB is BULL. It's simply increasing the visibility of the dealer's link.

The number of visits to dealer sites will rise. Even if the BOB button DOUBLES VDP referral traffic, the it'll still be a tiny part of a dealers overall web traffic.

The Eureka! (BOB) visitor is a HIGH ROI visitor.

#1). Let's toss that visitor a rich offer with a strong call to action that expires quickly!

#2). what of the lack of shopper visibility (which is the CORE problem of AT and Cars)?

Alex, in the land of unicorns and rainbows, your reply is right on the money. But... my very good friend, you've missed some stuff!

#1). Reps can't interview ups for lead sources without the shopper feeling like they are giving away secrets.

#2). Shoppers who are ups have spent 19hours on sites all over the internet, and have taken weeks and months to become an up. Any interview of an unsold up looking for lead source info is prone to significant error.

Drew, the exercise here is to focus on only ONE link on the VDP and understand what the link means to the shopper.

Drew, you are the master of CL world. This "Eureka! Link" applies to you as well. Casual shoppers don't visit dealers sites until they're ready to take it to the next level.

Drew,

I am on vaca, so details won't be rich with data.

#1). All clicks are NOT equal, think conversion funnel, then re-read my work.

#2). Re-look at the Google Analytics referral links, about 60% are from VDPs (aka Eureka! Link referrals).

#3). A VDP referral visit is what I consider VERY VERY rich ROI visitor. (Your example: 165 visitors * 60% = 99 highly motivated Eureka! Link visitors)

#4). On AT/Cars VDP to dealer link, add a "gateway page" with a strong shopper incentive (i.e. coupon with 24hr expiration).

If my instincts are correct, this VDP referral visitor is in the 11th hour and is looking for any excuse to make the commitment to visit the dealer.

Joe -

You stated a couple of times that there are still too many unanswered questions after an online automotive shopper has done their research and price discovery. I'm curious as to what information you feel a shopper can find on the dealer's website that they would not find in the online listings of a dealer doing a good job merchandising their inventory on ATC or cars.com.

There is so much specific vehicle information, multiple photos, dealership information, payment calculators, links to advice on buying, financing, leasing, insuring, online credit application, etc., what else is left for the shopper to ask other than, "do you still have the car?" And, in the case of a new car, if the dealer doesn't have THAT one, they'll have or can get another one just like it.

A prominent link to the dealer's web site (like ATC's BOB) is a great idea, but I don't believe the lack of such a link inhibits an online shopper from being able to proceed to the transaction step.

Studies have shown that what actually happens when the in-market online car buyer "vanishes" at the transaction step, as you put it, is that nearly 3/4 of them have done all of their online research and are now on their way to the dealership(s) that has the vehicle(s) of their choice. You can't touch, see or "drive" the product before the transaction step of an online air travel purchase, but you can with an automobile and that's the difference.

If I wanted to buy a new 55" flat screen television, I'd go online, do my research, do my price discovery and then.....I'd drive down to Best Buy or whatever retailer carried the TV I wanted so that I could first experience the picture and sound quality - and also make sure there wasn't something else I liked better - before making the transaction. Why would I call or email the store before doing so? I wouldn't, and studies show that most car buyers don't either.

As Alex pointed out, the problem is that most Dealer Principals don't incentivise or make it a condition of employment that salespeople and sales managers ACCURATELY ascertain from walk-in traffic what primarily influenced them to be in that dealership on that day to look at that car. Selecting "Drive by" should require management confirmation to be allowed in the stats.

As the leader of the Cars.com ad product management team, I’ve found this thread to be very helpful and I want to share some thoughts in terms of how Cars.com facilitates the relationship between buyer and seller. We strongly believe in allowing the consumer multiple ways to contact a seller with multiple entry points to a dealer’s website on vehicle detail pages and within our dealer directory. In fact, each month we generate over 1 million visits to individual dealer sites and we’ve been providing this form of contact to our customers for many years.

Know that we're listening to this feedback as we continually work on improving our product to provide the best car shopping experience for both shoppers and dealers. Driving traffic to your web sites is very valuable for many potential buyers and clearly beneficial to dealers. I’m not certain that it should take precedence over other forms of contact but it is something that we will continue to track and potentially improve.

I bring this up because Checkered Flag sits in a market with over 100,000 people in that market surfing from behind some significant security (Navy, Army, Marines, Contractors, etc). Anytime we compared clicks between reports there were massive discrepancies.

I don't know where your 5 dealers are that you're looking at Drew, but I agree it is good to see Autotrader making this change.

Yes - the reference 165 is one dealer. However - I am looking at 5 -- 3 on Dealer.com and 2 on Cobalt- all with similar variances.

Drew - you're looking at 1 dealership's reports and making some HUGE generalizations from that.

Man - I think you are missing the forest and focusing on one tree. I could care less about a 1-2% variance. ATC for last month shows 169 clicks, we show 165...pretty close IMO. K.I.S.S...don’t make it harder than it actually is or should be. I would rather ATC focus on getting my dealers customers, rather than talking to web hosting companies.

The problem will then become trying to explain why Autotrader's BOB reports shows so many more customers clicking to the dealer website than the dealer website analytics show are actually coming from Autotrader.

I had to learn about click report differences at Checkered Flag years ago. Talking about security preferences, firewalls, ghost browsers, and proxies is always a fun conversation with someone who could care less about that stuff.

Maybe Autotrader will get smart and talk to the major dealership web hosting companies about finding a way to make the numbers match better. If they don't do that, we're all going to be stressed around BOB within 30 days of its launch.

@alex - Ya, I was actually happy to hear about "BOB", esp with some of the dealer analytics I see....if this one dealer is already getting 165 clicks/visits a month from ATC...imagine now with BOB!

Alex
That idea of clear links back to the dealer's website...mmmmm...that's sounds so much like the AAN?