Question... can the URL from OEM site be tagged... i.e can you define a custom URL and tag for Google Analytics...

Independent Webmaster Guru Gets the Ax.

My pet project: http://www.breseechevrolet.com got the ax last week, to be replaced by Cobalt. New General Manger finds the value of the Cobalt/GM connection to be more important than current results:

Google PageRank = 5 (The highest Dealer PR site in the nation?!)
Top 3 Google SERP (Search Engine Results Page) for long tail requests like:

used chevy avalanche upstate ny
GM EQUINOX NEW YORK
used chevy silverado 2500hd in buffalo ny
Top 1,2,3 Google result for 98% of the COMPETITORS within 100 miles!

More Tangible Examples:
==> 30% of all site traffic was from Search Engine Connections.
==In last 24 months, 18% of all sales were to buyers greater than 45 minutes away (little eBay participation).
==F&I Post Sale Survey Says: 40-45% of all sales were visitors to http://www.breseechevrolet.com
==Constant deluge of "your site is very nice..."
from customers and Industry players.

It's a single point store in a rather small market, but we're #1 in Sales with NO NEWPAPER SPENDING.

Maybe it's time to move into MicroSites....
Shaking head in Syracuse,
Joe
p.s. Webmaster Brains for sale or lease!!
p.p.s. Google is the NEW yellow pages. To improve the message, we have callbright.com phone numbers on ALL of our Internet Properties. Phone traffic from http://www.breseechevrolet.com out numbers AutoTrader AND Cars.com by > 100:1. Calls for Svc. dept. are > 10% of site phone calls (very nice).

Many thanks to all for our responses! Alex and Ryan - thanks for your advice regarding SEO issues, and making sure to take this into considideration. Mitch - I agree on your advice regarding measuring results, my reason in making this post was hoping that someone has already done this and could share their experience. Lao-Shi - I agree that the info on 3rd party sites is often very similar to the OEM sites. However, because of branding and ownership of the product line, the OEM is going to get more traffic, and will inherently have more credibility with their information as the direct manufacturer of the product. Umer - great insight regarding what you do with your GM locations, thanks. Brian - BINGO! You espoused exactly what I need, and what I am looking for. Has anyone been in this same position and measured the results of having this live link to see if it was worthwhile??? And finally, Tom - do you have a Cobalt website with GM to get the live link? Many thanks to all, Kevin Frye/eCommerce Director/Jeff Wyler Automotive Family

For me, the value of having the link on the OEM listing comes from driving more potential customers to our site earlier in their research.
As I get leads in from GM, most have never been on our site. We spend allot of time and effort taking pictures of our new inventory as well as pre-owned. Enhancing the customers experience on our site. The information is we provide is robust and the lead generated from our site as opposed to GM's is more solid.

Kevin,

While the considerations over SEO, page rankings, etc. are all important, to me the most important question remains unanswered:

Does anyone have experience of how much more they made by having the GM/Cobalt site link vs. not having it?

If don't have that info, how about the following say for 3 months:

1) # leads dealership received from GM/OEM site
2) # delivered vehicles from those leads
3) Total front & back end gross on those sales
4) Cost of Cobalt site

In the above, duplicate leads + subsequent sales are attribued to the first source from which they are received.

Is the answer positive or negative?

It needs to be positive since other overhead factors need to be covered (sales compensation, CRM, BDC, etc.).

And not to be unfair to the GM/Cobalt structure, this should be done to all Internet efforts as any unprofitable efforts could be from things that could be fixed + have nothing to do with the Cobalt website.

I speak to Internet Managers all day long on such things. Here are some benchmarks:

1) Prospect : Sales ratio = 15-20%.... that's right for your own website leads & those from your OEM, the benchmark should be on par with what you are doing in the showroom. 3rd party leads will be 1/2 of that.

2) Front and back end grosses... Equal to your showroom grosses. Period. It's your process + talk tracks if you are not getting this. No difference for 3rd party leads.

Personally I like the plain vanilla dealership websites. I am on dealer websites every day so get to see the spectrum. Here's why I like them:

A dealer's website exists to make it convenient for a consumer to find, buy + communicate with you. And as a dealer, I only want you to find + communicate with me so you will buy from me.

So as a dealer, the goal of my website + what I do on the Internet is to get consumers to BUY service, parts & vehciles. The main problem I tend to see with sites that do more than what I call plain vanilla (research, inventory, about us, contact us) is the following:

1) Inquiring is NOT buying.
2) The sales psychology of websites designed to get the consumer to inquire is wrong / ineffective. For example, here's VIN decoder info on this new vehicle + its MSRP + maybe its price. Call or email. That would be ineffective in the showroom, why is that the implemented strategy on the Internet?
3) The above actually encourages those consumers willing to cough up their info this early to treat you like a commodity. Where is the bonding + rapport? Where is the sizzle to the new vehicle purchase?
4) And I don't mean add a bunch of gimmicks to the site, although those can be useful if they get the consumer communicating - what's my trade worth, live chat, etc.

But I digress... If your website is designed to get people to inquire so you can sell them an appointment + get them in to the showroom, then plain vanilla is just fine. Get the cheapest good one you can find (I actually like Cobalt's base package if that is the objective).

Shameless plug: If you want to add a member's only section with an eCommerce capability (verify email address to get in, but then get complete consumer facing desking + F+I experience, accurate prices, interest, rebates, etc.), again plain vanilla will do so the calls to action (BUY) don't get lost in the noise + navigation. Or at least that is what I recommend.

Best of Luck Kevin, and congratulations on asking the right questions.

Statistics and data can be skewed depending on who is conducting the study, new or pre owned vehicles, companys with an agenda, magazines that have a huge ad budget from a source that needs to have their image/product/service buffered and promoted.

Media giants that own large groups of diverse businesses like an ADP and others, businesses that need to be marketed. There are many scenarios; Madison Ave. has played this game for how many years?

One thing that rings true is when Mr. Toyota comes in on a date and time stamp and then comes in on our site and then comes in on a KBB and then surfaces again on another 3rd party site so on and so on we will not pay for the duplicates, we will only pay for the first lead.

In most cases the lead to the dealer site will be directed to the dealer from the OEM site. If the dealers are not diligent in watching the tracking and business source they can be paying for leads 2-3-4 times which adds up in annual costs.

The beauty of ecommerce and Internet Marketing is the source can be tracked, tracked as never before. We have not even scratched the surface of what is possible in this area. Just look at what the candidates in the American Political process are doing and you can see the potential for innovation. Every election year we are seeing innovation develop and new ways to use the technology.

The growth of the "Blog Phenomena" is another example. This is an area of tremendous opportunity that the political campaigns are spending more of their ad budgets on because they are able to track right to the moment a contributor comes on board and how much that person contributes thereafter. If this is not possible they would not be increasing their spending in this area.

We will also see the more intelligent OEMs take this to the next level as Toyota is doing for example. The Internet gives the OEM an opportunity to research & study the clients and market their products with greater efficiency. I believe some of the OEMs will continue drifting towards a more centralized model in sales and distribution over the next few years.

As successful as Toyota is the company is not resting on their "Laurels". They are consistently striving to be better and more efficient and the Internet is one of the tools they will use to achieve this goal.

Hmm... I don't think the page rank of GM will even pass to your OEM site. Google, Yahoo, MSN have no index of the dealer locater pages... if doing for SEO benefit then there is none. quick way to check if OEM passes any link love... link:www.OEMSiteDomain.com in any SE...

Most OEM dealer sites are exactly the same across dealerships... do a quick google search for fairway ford... all same... and only the home page indexed... so they have already been penalized.

Lao, I think the lead numbers that you are referring to are bit outdated... as numbers form AIADA june 2006 show number of leads from website to be higher then OEM site. 144 OEM 162 Website... (may be I'm reading that chart wrong). http://www.aiadalists.org/

Kevin, we have few GM dealers and none have bothered purchasing this link... it is so tiny on that page... why do it... plus you get the link to your site from the regional OEM sites...

It has been stated a number of times in studies on automotive ecommerce; the origin of most leads are from the OEM Sites. People have a tendency to go there first and drill down through the other sites in their research.

However how much different is most of the information on new vehicles from the OEM site and the third party sites? Not much

The more efficient OEM Sites are done very well and have a wealth of information.

I laugh at the debate that some dealers have on placing their new inventory on line while you can go to some OEM sites and place your zip code in and see what is in the delivery pipeline to the dealership before the dealer knows.

GM has mandated the Cobalt scheme as well as working with One Source, LMT beginning 3rd quarter 2006. You can have your leads forwarded however you still pay for the system and if you forward the leads you will pay twice. If you do not use the Cobalt Web Solution you will not have the link from the dealer site which will cost you business if your competitor has the Cobalt Solution.

We may see the same thing with Ford Group when LSI and Salespoint complete their union 4th quarter this year.

One solution, maybe SalesForce.com this maybe modified to adapt as a tool with a little finesse and tweaking. They also have formed an alliance with Google and created Google Groups. There is a special on Sales Force now ($600.00 per year) which normally runs about a $1000.00 a year and if they see an opportunity with an Industry in need such as the Auto Industry they might be very aggressive in assisting.

This could be a boon to the smaller Boutique Dealers that have more flexibility to be creative.

Like many things in life, it all depends.

As far as SEO, it's really not an issue unless you make a concerted effort to cause problems, i.e. posting the same exact 500-word PR article on both sites.

To me, a bigger issue is the capability of that OEM-approved site. I worked for an OEM who promoted what was probably the most worthless site in all of the industry, and everything we wanted to do on that site warranted charges by tech support. I measured the cost of the site plus the support fees, and divided by the clicks it brought me from the OEM (clicks, not leads), and cost-per-click came out to roughly $11. You couldn't spend that much on an AdWords PPC campaign if you tried.

I've worked with many OEMs but never GM, and even then, the way the Internet works for GM on the coasts is very different from the way it works in the rest of America.

I've seen OEMs that drive next to nothing to my site, and I've seen OEMs that are responsible for 60% of my total site's traffic. My advice is trial and error. And measurement.

While there is validity in the idea of negating SEO efforts with sites mirroring the same content, this could obviously be overcome by not making the mistake of having the same content on both or all your sites. There is a benefit to having multiple sites but, as Alex suggests, make sure their content is unique. Actually, more importantly than the content being unique across each site is making sure it is not exactly the same. You can convey similar content and the same message (relevancy) without displaying redundant or recycled information.

Since the OEM site drives so much traffic, I would advise that you use that web presence for targeting new vehicle buyers that go there, but then set up sister sites elsewhere for other shoppers, including other new vehicle shoppers. Check out the AutoBurst program designed to give dealers the ultimate SEO experience of owning their local markets with guaranteed top organic search listings.

Kevin,
From SEO (Search Engine Optimization) perspective it is never a good idea to have two site with similar content. You just don't know how Google and other Search Engines will respond. You might see all you SEO points disappear from you primary site, only to see your "basic template" Cobalt site start showing in the search results.
I looked at GM site and it has a Google Page Rank of 8 out of 10. This means that a link from GM site is very valuable from SEO perspective and as a result Google just might give your "Cobalt" site a higher rank than your existing site. (Not sure if this is the desired effect you are looking for.)
I guess one thing you can do is put a link from the "Cobalt" site to your primary site to help and balance things out.
One thing to keep in mind is that SEO advice and opinions are like you (know what). Everyone has one and no one knows exactly how things will play out. If you stand to get a good amount to traffic from GM it could prove to be a worth while thing.

LOL. Reynolds and ADP will always be restricted in what functionality they can provide. They are using 19 century technology to tackle 21 century problems. Dealers are so busy with putting out fires everyday that they will never make the decision to switch over to another system. Most of the auto dealer business is short sighted. What have you done for me lately? Sales and Service revenues are counted daily and monthly and management's mood swings are dependent on the two. There us has to be an external factor pushing for a sudden change. It seems that dealers or for that matter anyone working for them want to do the least amount of work for the most amount of money and the result is that the auto dealers are perhaps the most inefficient sector of our economy. The auto industry is going through major changes. They will never sell 17 million cars a year again and cars are becoming more reliable. I predict Reynolds goes out of business and ADP switches over to ORacle or SQL. The limitation my friends is all in the databases.

Lao, I do not wish to have a posting argument with you over Microsoft. We (my dealership) are partners with them as well, and we believe Microsoft has a long way to go before they're ready to offer something as stable as ADP or Reynolds & Reynolds on the DMS side. They do have some other tools that look more promising, but at the end of the day it is going to boil down to DMS.

As far as the other portion of this topic goes, you're absolutely right. One should not be afraid of change. However, one can always be critical of the prospect.

A bit of good news:

I heard Toyota is going to make the list of CRM/ILM's very long. Their intentions are not to limit dealer selection, but to protect dealers from some of the smaller companies who can really disrupt business. As usual Toyota is thinking ahead, but Toyota was never my concern. I'm worried about some of the other manufacturers who might not have such a long list.

I have spoken with Microsoft a number of times over the past year on their solution and I am a Microsoft Partner. They are not that far away. They will be in Beta shortly, maybe by 2nd quarter 08 in test markets.

There is a Chinese phrase roughly translated: If we always do what we have always done we will always get what we have always got.

We should always be willing to look at something new.

Microsoft is continuously brought up, but Microsoft is years (10-15 years) away from coming on the scene. They are so far away, they aren't even worth mentioning.

Lao - have you ever heard of the Blue Oval? Aside from it being Ford's logo it was also a reinvention scheme they employed. The idea behind the Blue Oval was to cut the dealer out of the picture. Ford owned and operated a few dealerships, thus selling directly to the customer. Ford failed in this attempt because they interpreted the customers wrong and had trouble competing with other dealers. I was not in the sales department when it happened, but that is what I have been told about it in a nutshell.

I am not against our manufacturers, but I am a bit weary of their forceful involvement in a world they do not fully understand. They have hit it right a few times doing this type of thing in the past, but I still remain skeptical. It is all rumor at this point.

To answer your last question Lao, I'd love to see OEM's monitor CRM's. I have to throw some stings on that statement though. I'd love to see OEM's monitor CRM's if:

1. Offered bonuses based on good results (example: travel incentives for GM's when their store completes all one on ones for a quarter)
2. Dealership's Internet department has an eight minute response time, so they get more leads
3. Activities are punished and rewarded

The entire CRM/ILM monitoring would need to be a give/take scenario with the underlying goal being to push more metal over the curb. I'd love that! If it is a way to turn dealerships into chain-organizations, then I'm not on board.

I am not sure this new trend is such a bad idea. To have the sales processes become more centralized maybe be a good trend at least one to look at for the near term.

So many dealers are doing so many different processes that are unnoticed because they are low on the radar screen. The big groups dominate the attention and the sales process usually with "Cookie Cutter" approaches that center on big discounts, slash and burn sales, any vehicle $77.00, we will not be under sold. They just want to move lots of metal.

Employing new processes with new technology may bring to the surface new ideas that the "Boutique Dealers" are using and that are working in their locales. If the OEM's see what works and is profitable the smart ones will embrace them.

Maybe Microsoft's new solution will bring tools to the game that will offer alternatives to the "archaic" DMS system ADP offers. We will not know unless we are willing to try.

It certainly cannot hurt to try, as we cannot argue with the success of Toyota and Honda's strategists. We are also witnessing the arrival of the Korean brands and models as well as the Chinese Brands that are on the Horizon. We will be in a much different game in the next few years, as each of these new arrivals will bring new strategies to the game. These are strategies that are unique and will be more aggressive and formidable than the Japanese model.

The OEMs and dealers that are in link and know what the local consumer is looking for will have an edge in this game. As we learned from our tournament with the Japanese challenge they knew and know more about what American consumers want than the American OEMs. How did they learn this?? by research and listening to the consumer. The Korean and Chinese OEM's will do the same

Many of the American businesses will be in denial about this and complain that the competition had unfair advantages??? (Some can rationalize anything). However lets face the facts Toyota and Honda are doing well, making vehicle the consumers like well and they are profitable.

I say lets bring the new DMS solutions to the game after all ADP is a dinosaur and no longer the best solution. Reynolds maybe a slight improvement but we need tools for today not yesterdays with a little "bondo" and "Earl's $29.99" I'll paint any car paint job.

GM is already moving in this direction with "One Source", Ford has been drifting in this direction for a few years whether it is part of a plan or just a trend they are not aware of.

This new system will allow the smart, consumer savvy, OEMs to learn more about what the consumers want and think about their products and streamline the process in sales and delivering the inventory to the customer. They will be able to monitor the consumers leads and comments, what they are looking for and are interested in. The smart OEM's will learn and listen and profit as will the dealers.

So rather then dread the change/evolution let's embrace it.

What do we have to lose?

Good post Alex. I apologize, my response was definitely more ILM biased, and I see your point. For those of us who are on the leading edge with our sales process, I think your final line brings the most concern! Depending on which OEM I am working with (and I will not name which), some are pushing sound sales processes that I would support, while others have "softer" (is that pc? - lol) sales processes that I am not comfortable in fully working with. Keep up the great insight Alex! Kevin Frye/eCommerce Director/Jeff Wyler Automotive Family

Kevin,

Thank you for your response. Yes, anyone in the auto business should be aware of how DMS providers operate. However, I don't think the recent push to privatize customer information further to be something shady against 3rd party vendors. If that were the case they would have done it a long time ago. I believe this is fully being done in accordance with privacy laws.

As for the manufacturers pushing CRM/ILM's on dealers, no, it is nothing new on the ILM side. It is very new on the CRM side. Now that technology is available to monitor almost every aspect of a dealership's business from anywhere in the world, manufacturers are wanting to see how "their" customers are being treated.

Aside from creating a major hassle of which providers to choose in the future, there is another side to where all this could lead. Mitch, the first commenter in this thread, caught onto it. If manufacturers dictate which technologies to use, then the next step is to QMSify (Quality Management) our sales process. You put these three things together:

equal technology + equal sales process + one price approach (coming) = every franchised dealer being like a fast food chain on new and certified cars.

Would any of us be truly surprised if the primary DMS providers decided to make it incredibly difficult for 3 party providers to have access to our respective DMS? Have any of us been blind to the pattern of smaller vendors rising up to become formidable competition to Reynolds and ADP, then learn that those smaller vendors have been bought out by Reynolds or ADP? It is the nature of this industry... I am curious as to see the shakedown that will result with Microsoft's entry into this market.

As for being forced to use a specific ILM/CRM, I have seen this with several of my OEM's. However, over time, they have opened up access to use other "certified" ILM/CRM packages. While I don't like being forced to use a certain ILM/CRM (especially when I have a better system), I am patient in allowing some time to pass and having the OEM then allow us to use our own system. Kevin Frye/eCommerce Director/Jeff Wyler Automotive Family

Mitch writes: "...Most dealers are successful by accident when left to their own devices."

I second that opinion!

Thanks for the heads up Alex and like yourself...

I have heard similar rumblings in the last few years. The rumors I heard were how the big DMS companies would completely deny access to dealership information from 3rd party vendors.

Why does a dealership need a "DMS"? I don't know this answer and maybe others can shed light for me?

Im just a car guy that has taken the time to learn some of the technology available to the dealership via CRM/DMS integration, but I see this as a strong arm of the DMS's to soley use their product (good or bad) for all functions wanted.

Not being as familiar with what the DMS's provide on the accounting side, but other than that- are there not CRM tools that with a little tweaking would be able to provide all of the services needed to dealerships aside from the accounting and maybe some of the service/parts department functions?

Example: Pulling new car inventory from the manufacturers (manually entering used) and ability it to other 3rd party vendors, enter customer info via dl scanner, not having to "push" a paperless deal into a DMS instead working right out of the CRM tool? Besides, CRM tools are already integrating the service and parts dept information now with internet and showroom.

One place for the manufacturers to observe all the dealerships processes and results from all departments.

Maybe Im just a simpleton?

You may be right Mitch. I can see it now....

Welcome to McDonalds Toyota, would you like a Corolla with that?

Nice post Alex...

Nissan also demands that you work with their approved CRM vendors... but they have approved 23 of them, so does it really matter if Toyota goes this route? I'd say no, if they approve anywhere near that many. Most dealers are bandwagon folk, and the number of dealers who will want to use a custom-built tool or an unapproved tool is small enough that it's worth the mandate.

What concerns me more is that every manufacturer and vendor seems to be getting more active in telling the dealer how to run their business... and as much as I'd love to debate that line of thinking, I really can't. Most dealers are successful by accident when left to their own devices.